Individual XP - Collectively?

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Havard
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Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by Havard »

I never liked the rules for individual XP bonuses based on class from the DMG, mainly because they seemed to favour the fighters. Also I always liked the collective experience of AD&D where the players all work towards a common goal.

So I was thinking, how about a system where XP bonuses are rewarded for individual class actions and abilities, but where these bonuses are added to the pool of group XPs and then shared equally at the end of the session?

This way, there would be less competition/conflict between the players, but at the same time, everyone would feel like they had a chance to contribute to the shared rewards in a more specific way than the general XP system. I could suddenly see the Fighter player encouraging the Thief to use his abilities more etc...



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Re: Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by Gecko »

It's been a long time since I've used 2e, but from what I remember they were intended to encourage and award the player to portray their class (The fighter should fight, the paladin should fight evil, the mage should cast, the Thief should sneak, etc.).

Wouldn't the net effect of your idea effectively penalize the whole group if one or two players don't portray their role? Given that it turns the award from an individual encouragement to play a certaint way into missed group xp if some members don't play a certaint way?

Of course, conversely under the RAW if the DM doesn't set up balanced encounters (as in giving each class an oportunity to shine) then some classes do fall behind under these rules (the were optional rules right?)

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Re: Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by BlackBat242 »

The DMs I played 2E with gave individual XP for class-based things as well as hp done to opponents, etc... and a base "whole adventure" XP that was the same for each party member, thus using both schemes at once.
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Re: Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by Boneguard »

I play first edition, but our GM made his own list of "Class" and "Race" individual xp awards which he combines with the collective XP from defeating creatures. As Gecko indicated, those bonus xp awards are meant to encourage roleplaying your character by making use of all of their class/racial ability or promoting racial agenda.

The combination of both collective and individual xp awards eventually evens out (especially as we use training rules) and even allows slow progression classes (like cavalier or magic-user) to keep up with the fastest one (say the cleric or fighter).
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Re: Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by Havard »

Just to clarify, I wasn't proposing to replace this system with the pool of base XP awards. As in the DMG optional rules, the individual XPs are added in addition to the base XP award, similar to what Blackbat mentions. The main difference is that instead of earning benefits for himself, each player can now help add to the pool.

I guess you could get a situation where players are annoyed with other players who don't contribute as much as the others, but ideally they should instead encourage eachother to play out their characters more. Hmmm...gotta think about this.

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Re: Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by Boneguard »

Havard wrote:
I guess you could get a situation where players are annoyed with other players who don't contribute as much as the others, but ideally they should instead encourage eachother to play out their characters more. Hmmm...gotta think about this.

-Havard
Well that is where training can come in...not so much the 2nd edition version, but the 1st edition version works well here. The short version is that at each encounter the character is awarded a "rating poing" from 1 (excellent) to 4 (Poor) that indicate how well was the character true to his class. When it comes time to train this rating is used to determined how many days/week is required to train (and also how much it will cost to do so).

This really encourage players to use their player to it's full potential as it quickens training and end up being cheaper to train.
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Re: Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by willpell »

Havard wrote:I never liked the rules for individual XP bonuses based on class from the DMG, mainly because they seemed to favour the fighters. Also I always liked the collective experience of AD&D where the players all work towards a common goal.
In 3E fighters need favoring. Can you tell me, a non-2E-speaker, how this works, so I can try to adapt it?

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Re: Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by Gecko »

BlackBat242 wrote:... thus using both schemes at once.
yeah, the systems are meant to be used together, as Havard says.
willpell wrote:
Havard wrote:I never liked the rules for individual XP bonuses based on class from the DMG, mainly because they seemed to favour the fighters.
In 3E fighters need favoring. Can you tell me, a non-2E-speaker, how this works, so I can try to adapt it?
Off the top of my head, the biggest one was that they got bonus xp based on the number of HD defeated in combat amongst other such bonus's.

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Re: Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by BlackBat242 »

In 1E the only set XP awards other than for treasure/magic items gained were that each PC got a certain number of XP per hit point inflicted upon opponent creatures, plus a base XP award for each opponent "defeated" (these numbers were listed in the creature description in the DMG/MM/FF/MM2). If more than one defeated a particular creature the base XP was to be split "according to the relative contribution to the defeat".

If one PC did more damage and defeated more creatures, than that PC got more XP than the others - naturally until the mage could cast fireball, or the cleric cast blade barrier, etc. the fighter was the one collecting more XP.

There were vague comments in the DMG about awarding more XP "for good role-play', but there were no specific "BTB" XP awards for casting non-damage spells, or picking locks, or disarming traps, etc - only for inflicting damage or defeat, and for what loot you made it back to town with.


I know 2E began suggesting XP be awarded for using class abilities (spell-casting, lock-picking, etc) to "even things out", but I never DM'ed a 2E game, only played in them - so I never really looked closely at the "BTB" 2E XP rules - I started DM'ing 1E in 1984, and still use those rules (with some 2E stuff to expand things) when I run a game.
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Re: Individual XP - Collectively?

Post by Grimnir »

In my 2e game I use a combination for awarding xp. After each sessions I will give out the xp for each party member, based on a number of things; adversaries defeated, good role playing, class achievements, and any story bonus I choose to add.

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